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KRAD's Inaccurate Guide to Life - the difference between fanfic and profic
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the difference between fanfic and profic
At UConn-Storrs this past Monday, one of the students in the Science Fiction class asked me what the difference was between what I do (write media tie-ins) and what fanfic writers do (beyond the obvious that profic pays and fanfic doesn't).

There are four primary differences between the two.

The first two are ones where I view profic as "superior" to fanfic. First off, fanfic is illegal and profic isn't. This is not an irrelevant concern -- we're talking about the theft of intellectual property. Does that mean fanfic shouldn't happen? Of course not -- I've written fanfic, read fanfic, enjoyed fanfic. But then, I also enjoy driving very fast, and sometimes state police have something to say about it, and I have to pay a ticket. Of course, most of the owners of those intellectual properties turn a blind eye, mainly because no money is being made off the fanfic, and since money is the primary reason for protecting your IP...

Secondly, profic has professional oversight. While it's true that there are good fanfic beta readers and that there are bad tie-in editors (and also bad tie-in editing jobs, which are often due to circumstances beyond anyone's control), in general, I'm going to trust the judgment of a professional in the field. Nine times out of ten, you'll get a better result from the pro than the amateur (which is why you generally hire plumbers to fix your toilet instead of doing it yourself). And way too much of the fanfic I have read is so obviously unedited it makes my teeth hurt -- and I'm not talking about typos and minor grammar mistakes, I'm talking about global writing problems that no pro editor worth her salt would let fly for half a second.

The third one -- and this and the fourth thing aren't value judgments in either direction, but simply stating the difference between the two -- is that fanfic is completely freeform. Profic has to be of a certain type: novel, novella, short story. These are formats with very specific needs and requirements. Fanfic writers, though, can go crazy. They can do drabbles, they can do scenes, they can do vignettes, they can do 600,000-word novels (some of them all one paragraph) without any complaints. Profic is much more standardized.

The last one, and this is the biggie, is that profic has to satisfy a much larger audience. There's really only one person who has to be satisfied with a piece of fanfic, and that's the writer. Fanfic writers are only obligated to be true to their own interpretations of the characters. And they aren't required to get a significant readership -- hell, most fanfics aren't read by more than a few dozen people.

Profic, OTOH, has to satisfy several people before it ever sees print: the writer, the book's editor, and whoever is responsible for approving the story, which in some cases can be several people (which goes back to the oversight thing above). That person approving the story for the copyright holder is sometimes someone intimately involved with the creation of the property -- and sometimes it's a flunky in the licensing department. But it's still a representative of the people responsible who has to say yes to it.

And there's another, far more important element to that: profic has to satisfy a much larger reading audience.

The audience for fanfic is, as I said, often a few dozen people. Some fandoms inspire fanfic to the degree that a few thousand people read it.

If that number of people bought tie-in novels, there would be no tie-in novels, because they wouldn't be commercially viable. The lowest selling tie-ins sell 20,000 copies in mass-market paperback, and most sell more than that. Fanfic's standards for success are almost nonexistent, and even their successes are miniscule in terms of numbers of readers compared to the requirements for mass-market publishing that have to be met.

What that means is that profic has to be palatable to a mass audience. The author's own unique interpretation, shared with several close friends, isn't really going to fly, because that singular vision won't necessarily appeal to a wider audience. (I'm not just talking about slash here, though that's the obvious, and there's no way a mass-market audience is going to go for, say Kirk/Spock hurt/comfort fiction.....)

So there you go. Hope this has been helpful. As likely as not, it's been inflammatory, but what the hell.....

Current Mood: thoughtful
Current Music: tonight's The Wedding Bells

Comments
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querldox From: [info]querldox Date: April 7th, 2007 03:03 am (UTC) (Link)
Did you see Charlie Brown's bit in the latest Locus where he goes off on tie-in writers?
Part of his Editorial Matters section.
kradical From: [info]kradical Date: April 7th, 2007 03:14 am (UTC) (Link)
Heard about it, but haven't read it.

Locus becomes less relevant with each passing month, so I can't really muster up the energy to give an airborne intercourse.
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willdevine From: [info]willdevine Date: April 7th, 2007 03:39 am (UTC) (Link)
Your response was very enlightening. Thank you for sharing it here.
kradical From: [info]kradical Date: April 7th, 2007 02:34 pm (UTC) (Link)
You're welcome!
From: (Anonymous) Date: April 7th, 2007 03:51 am (UTC) (Link)
Oh yeah, Mr. Meanie! My story, in which Wesley Crusher invents a mind control device and, being the least horny teenager in the history of mankind, decides to use it to become Captain of the Enterprise (instead of scoring with Troi) and after his mind control device breaks instead of punishing him they promote him to commander and give him Ricker's job because he does such a good job as captain, is way better than any of your profic. Plus it is 500 8x11 pages long and has 20 whole chapters written entirely in perfect Klingon. Oh it also has a character named after myself and a super intelligent dog named after my dog. I don't recall ever seeing any characters named Keith R.A. DeCandido in your Gorkon novels, which you had the audacity to write in ENGLISH!! Oh, and the preceding paragraph is 100% facetious.
kradical From: [info]kradical Date: April 7th, 2007 02:35 pm (UTC) (Link)
Oh, and the preceding paragraph is 100% facetious.

Worked that out on my own, but thanks for sharing it anyhow. *falls over laughing*
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romulantbonz From: [info]romulantbonz Date: April 7th, 2007 04:19 am (UTC) (Link)
Another difference is that usually fanfic is written for free and profic is written with the expectation of being paid. As a new writer, I won't give away my fiction writing for nothing.

And as you've said, fanfic is usually (but not always) of an inferior quality.
kradical From: [info]kradical Date: April 7th, 2007 05:31 am (UTC) (Link)
Another difference is that usually fanfic is written for free and profic is written with the expectation of being paid.

Er, yeah, I kinda said that right off.....
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briansiano From: [info]briansiano Date: April 7th, 2007 04:20 am (UTC) (Link)
I'm not keen on terms like profic and fanfic. Not over any principle: they just grate on my eyes and ears. And your comments re "profic" apply mainly to media tie-ins, so I wouldn't use them when comparing fan fiction to, say, the work that Don deLillo or Jonathan Franzen do. But I don't disagree with anything you've written.

Personally, I _hate_ fan fiction. I can understand it as one of those things aspiring writers go through at some larval stage of development. But I look at it this way. There are scads of knockoffs and re-toolings of the major works, faux-Tolkiens and faux-Moorcocks and faux Heinleins, and we tend to hold these in mild contempt for being derivative. Fan fiction is a step _below_ those in terms of originality: the writers can't even file the serial numbers off properly.

On a side note. Back when the next generation Trek show was on, and there was a mild controversy about Trek fan fiction being circulated on this new intertube thingie, a friend and I came up with an idea that, I like to think, cut in many ways, satirically speaking. If Paramount didn't want unauthorized Trek stories floating about, fine: someone could create an open-source system so Trek stories could be read under a different set of parameters.

It'd be called X-trek, with different names for the characters, different names for the planets and institutions and aliens and weapons and FTL travel and uniforms and, gahd-forbid, grunty languages, all copyright-free and open-source. Users could use-- or develop-- search-and-replace macros to change their Trek fan fiction into X-trek fiction. They would also be free to work up whatever, canon, technical manuals, illustrations, and terms they wanted, as long as it was all copyright-free.

We had no plans to actually _do_ this; it was just an idea that said fuck-you to the fanfic people and, mildly, to Paramount. To Paramount, the message was simpe: keep yer copyrights, we'll come up with a workaround. To the fanfic writers, it said: you're so bereft of creativity that we're spoon-feeding you a template that'll enable you to continue writing derivative garbage based on a property owned by a corporation.
sinanju From: [info]sinanju Date: April 7th, 2007 06:51 am (UTC) (Link)
Must every amateur singer be consigned to "hack"-dom because he doesn't write his own stuff, being content to sing classic folk songs or covers of other peoples' music? If I turn a kitchen full of ingredients into delicious food what purpose is served by shouting "Fuck you!" at me because I don't invent New Taste Treats (tm).

If you want to become a published commercial writer then, yeah, you're probably better off writing your own stuff. But if you're doing it for your entertainment, or the entertainment of your friends/correspondents, what's so awful about writing fanfic? How is it really different* from people telling and retelling and altering or adding to the tales of Robin Hood or King Arthur or other figures of legend. There are a lot of variations on those stories because a lot of people told different versions over the centuries. They (gasp) made up stories using pre-existing characters!

*Other than that big corporations own the rights to Mulder & Scully or Captain Picard. Yes, it's illegal, but so what? It's mostly done for fun, and nobody is making money off of it and if they were foolish enough to try the real copyright owners have the full weight of the legal system on their side, assuming a "cease and desist" letter doesn't do the trick.
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authorm From: [info]authorm Date: April 7th, 2007 12:54 pm (UTC) (Link)
Do you find you get sneered at, anyway?

This is coming from a romance/erotic fiction writer, btw, and we tend to be pretty low on the totem pole when it comes to literary pats on the back.

I clearly see a difference between writing sanctioned fiction based on someone else's characters and world and just taking those characters and world and manipulating them for your own satisfaction. But do writers of "real" SF and F look down on tie-in media with as much disdain as they do fanfic? Or are you granted a little more respect by your peers because your work is approved by someone?

M
kradical From: [info]kradical Date: April 7th, 2007 02:32 pm (UTC) (Link)
I don't get sneered at by anyone whose opinion I actually care about. *grin*

The IAMTW was formed to combat this tendency to thumb one's nose at tie-in fiction. Having said that, said disdain is much less than it used to be, and in fact grows less with each year I'm in the field. Most of the people who do look down on it now are the old cranks like Charlie Brown of Locus, who think the world would be a better place if things were exactly the way they were in the Good Old Days, dammit, when SF writers were real men who typed on typewriters and fans had mimeograph machines that they walked ten miles in the snow barefoot to get to, and so on.

(And then there are the segments of capital-F Fandom who actually view fanfic as superior to profic because it's the author's unique vision, and isn't beholden to The Man, as it were.)
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grrli From: [info]grrli Date: April 7th, 2007 01:55 pm (UTC) (Link)
Opinions can be very inflammatory, but logic is like... the hemorrhoidal cream when applied. Everyone has a right to opinion, and also, many of your opinions are based on logical deduction as well as a knowlege from the side of writing that not all fan ficcers have.

I agress that fanfic is theft of intellectual property. It's also a fact of life that things worth enjoyment are always replicated. If there is no marketed responses, then the void is filled by those that feel it's pull.

It's no one's fault but time and red tape that kept you from putting a novel out until August. We simply have no patience, and, like you said, it's like speeding. Who doesn't like pushing metal? God I know I do.

I see only three differences, personally. I see that profic is sanctioned by those who have FINANCIAL rights to the property (which may or may not be the person who came up with it in the first place).

Profic is paid for by said purchasers of intellectual property. How much they pay, well... that depends, again. Some houses are really cheap slavedrivers, I've gathered. Others are good to work with.

Prowriters have faith in the product they create to entertain not only themselves but the fanbase at large. Fanficcers generally don't.
kradical From: [info]kradical Date: April 7th, 2007 02:42 pm (UTC) (Link)
Thanks for the thoughtful reply!
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neadods From: [info]neadods Date: April 7th, 2007 02:35 pm (UTC) (Link)
On the whole, I agree with you, with some amendments.

Fanfic isn't just freeform regarding size and structure, but also plot. Without the copyright owner's strictures regarding audience, the fanficcers can take main characters and do *anything* to them. (And frequently do.) This can be squicky, brilliant, or both. I'll leave the examples of squicky stuff as an exercise in unpleasant memories for the reader - as for brilliant, I'm going to say that I like Jean Lorrah's fanfic much better than her Star Trek tie-in novels because when she was unofficial she could do more with them, which made them more interesting to me as characters.

Flat out disagree with There's really only one person who has to be satisfied with a piece of fanfic, and that's the writer. I mean, yeah, there are plenty of people who write fanfic as public masturbation, but that's arguably usually given the brushoff it deserves. As opposed to when certain professional authors do the same thing, and then scream that their detractors are interrogating the text from the wrong perspective when the readership doesn't line up to fall fawning all over them.

Which leads to the last amendment - while it's true that profic usually has to satisfy more people to even get published than fanfic, it's equally true that when a badly-written typofest goes up on the net, there's only one person to blame, and no money changes hands when it is read. As opposed to when it becomes painfully obvious that an author is either tired of their series (or wasn't competent to write it in the first place without strong editorial help which they're now refusing) and the damn thing is still being shoved out on the assumption that the public will pay hardback prices for any typo porn vomited out by a Big Name. I once wrote a nastygram to an editor asking point blank why they thought that the latest book in a series was worth my money when they obviously hadn't considered it worth a simple mechanical spellcheck.

Can I link this in my LJ at some point?
kradical From: [info]kradical Date: April 7th, 2007 02:52 pm (UTC) (Link)
I meant to mention the freeform plot element, too. Duh.


Flat out disagree with There's really only one person who has to be satisfied with a piece of fanfic, and that's the writer. I mean, yeah, there are plenty of people who write fanfic as public masturbation, but that's arguably usually given the brushoff it deserves.

I disagree with your disagreement. Fanfic isn't dependent on readership to survive. If people stop buying books in sufficient numbers, the books stop being published. If nobody reads a fanfic, it doesn't have any impact on whether or not the writer continues to write.


As opposed to when it becomes painfully obvious that an author is either tired of their series (or wasn't competent to write it in the first place without strong editorial help which they're now refusing) and the damn thing is still being shoved out on the assumption that the public will pay hardback prices for any typo porn vomited out by a Big Name. I once wrote a nastygram to an editor asking point blank why they thought that the latest book in a series was worth my money when they obviously hadn't considered it worth a simple mechanical spellcheck.

Actually, the reasons why typofests are published in books are usually because the book was running horribly late for whatever reason (sometimes the author's fault, sometimes the licensor's fault, sometimes the fault of some other project that fell by the wayside forcing this book to be cranked out quickly), not because of the reasons you state. But if books are full of typos or spellchecking errors, it's almost never because the editor couldn't be bothered, but because the editor (for whatever reason) didn't have time.


Can I link this in my LJ at some point?

By all means.
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suricattus From: [info]suricattus Date: April 7th, 2007 02:50 pm (UTC) (Link)
But then, I also enjoy driving very fast, and sometimes state police have something to say about it, and I have to pay a ticket

<<------ That. Yes. Exactly.


I was on a semi-infamous panel on fanfic once and took heat because I said, quite bluntly "what part of 'against the established and upheld law' do you want to pretend doesn't exist?" Yes, I used to write fanfic to blow off steam and frustration. I never pretended it was anything other than it was, and if I'd gotten a C&D I would have C'd and D'd.

Ficcing is fun. It also soothes the twitch during the seemingly expanding ing rerun seasons, and sustains a fandom. But like speeding, and smoking pot, and drinking before you're 21, and boosting a box of condoms or a diet coke from the corner store, it's illegal, and other people have the right to stop you.


(my personal take on Retrievers fic or gaming is 'Don't tell me, don't show me, and I don't have to officially know/take official action.')

kradical From: [info]kradical Date: April 7th, 2007 02:54 pm (UTC) (Link)
Well said. And that attitude in your last paragraph is pretty much how most copyright holder view such things.

It's all fun and games until someone puts an eye out....
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yahtzee63 From: [info]yahtzee63 Date: April 7th, 2007 04:32 pm (UTC) (Link)
I wouldn't consider this inflammatory at all -- it's fair and largely accurate. I fully believe that fanfic could and should qualify as transformative "fair use" and therefore is not illegal copyright infringement, any more than parody is. I realize that this has not been adjudicated and therefore I don't freak when people disagree -- it could turn out any which way. However, the longer it goes without being ajudicated, the more likely it becomes that copyright holders will not ever test this in court. The time for the big media companies to draw a line in the sand was about 15 years ago, and they didn't.

(And yes, I say this as a fanfic writer -- but once upon a time, I was a lawyer, too, and while the "fair use" argument might not win in court, it might, because it's a solid, well-grounded argument. It's not the convenient invention most non-lawyers/anti-ficcers assume, and the fanfic writer/lawyer who has done the most to spread this concept is not the "internet lawyer" I've seen her derided as -- she previously practiced at one of the top 10 firms in the country, and she currently teaches IP courses at Georgetown Law.)

I would also add that, while you'd usually get a professional to do your plumbing instead of the neighbor, there are neighbors out there who are pretty fantastic handymen. If you hang around long enough, and push yourself hard enough, you might find them.

I entirely agree that profic has to appeal to a broader audience. I have seen fanfic that could/would have that kind of appeal (if they allowed HP tie-ins, wouldn't you agree that some of [info]marinarusalka's gen work would more than fit the bill?), but most of it is designed for narrower tastes. Which is why the system is so perfect: The few people who want to read, say, Peter Petrelli/Hiro Nakamura hurt/comfort aren't denied because market forces aren't in their favor. They can create, they can find, they can read. Profic authors don't have to cater to rabid fannish tastes, and fanfic authors don't have to worry whether their femslash B5 epic will play in Peoria. And this theoretical viewer in Peoria can go to the store and purchase the adventure that will appeal to his tastes without encountering any rude introductions to wingfic or MPREG.

The only thing I ever find "inflammatory" about the profic/fanfic debate is the short-sighted insistence that nobody who is "really" a writer would ever write fanfic, that if you have the "soul of a writer" (I have seen this language), you would never stoop to taking inspiration from somebody else's characters. As a tie-in author, I am sure you find this argument equally insulting. I've written and sold original fiction, written and sold tie-in fiction and written (though, naturally, not sold) fanfic. The stories arise from the same place, and I think as authors we should celebrate each other's inspirations and accept that that the tales we tell sometimes arise from the strangest places -- and fanfiction is far from the strangest!
kradical From: [info]kradical Date: April 7th, 2007 07:23 pm (UTC) (Link)
There are issues regarding your fair use argument, which [info]suricattus makes elsewhere here, particularly with the stuff based on prose works. JK Rowling can afford to turn a blind eye to Harry Potter fanfic because she's JK Rowling, Super Author, who owns a mansion and a yacht, but the slope gets a whole lot slipperier when you get down to the level of midlist genre authors who suddenly find themselves forced to defend their intellectual property, and I think it would suck big green rocks through a straw if those midlist authors got screwed because Paramount/CBS has been turning a blind eye to K/S fiction since the 1970s.
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sl_podcast From: [info]sl_podcast Date: April 7th, 2007 04:53 pm (UTC) (Link)
As the host of a fanfic podcast I have to agree with most of your statements. I'm a pro-nonfiction writer and a lot of fanfic would get serious laughs if not total ignores from my editors.

On the other hand, and don't take this personally, there are some fanfic authors that I'd take ANY day over some of the novels I've read. Why? They're awesome writers! I could see their story appealing to a mass audience, but I digress.

As for the legality of fanfic, I put that discussion on my soap box of fan created content should be deemed legal as long as no one is making money of it. I believe it keeps people in the fandom. For example, a fan created podcast is pushing for people to read the Buffy/Angel and Firefly novels because we want them to continue. But then again, I'm all for copyright laws being changed to fit with Web 2.0's vastly changing world.
suricattus From: [info]suricattus Date: April 7th, 2007 05:48 pm (UTC) (Link)
There is also the argument of brand confusion -- media fanfic is not prone to being confused with a television show. Fanfic created around a written work, however, does create potential confusion, and is therefore a risk.

but here we get into the area of people who as "why should a writer be allowed to protect their copyright on characters and worlds, the big unsharing meanies" and that's where I tend to lose my temper, so I will go back to work now...

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athenamuze From: [info]athenamuze Date: April 7th, 2007 05:48 pm (UTC) (Link)
As was mentioned here, I have to tell you that I have read quite a bit of fanfic AND profic and the majority of the time? I would rather stick with the fanfic. There are a lot of poorly done ones surely, but in my experience I have been so incredibly disappointed in most mass media paperbacks I have picked up. I will keep trying, looking for the occasional good one but overall I find it MUCH easier to find good, well written, fanfic then the other. This possibly could have a lot to do with the quantity of fanfic available, the restrictions on the story due to (blah blah), but if I am paying for it, I would hope it's better! In general? Not so much. On the whole I have found myself incredibly disappointed in the profic out there.
kradical From: [info]kradical Date: April 7th, 2007 07:37 pm (UTC) (Link)
My experience is 180 degrees from yours, honestly. But hey, that's what makes horse races. *grin*

Out of curiosity, which tie-ins have you read and found wanting? Because I read a lot of tie-ins, both professionally and for pleasure, and I find quite a bit of it to be very good, but it does vary widely from franchise to franchise.
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